#1701074 - 09/02/09 01:50 PM
SQ help
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poopyhead
SD Ralph Wiggum
Registered: 04/12/09
Posts: 32
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right now I have 4 way pioneer 6.5 coaxial speakers and a cheap sony hu. I am looking at upgrading to some morel tempo six seakers for better sq. Just wondering if it would even be worth the money and how much better it would sound. Im kinda hoping that if i got them i would just be amazed at the sq but i dont even know if it would sound much better. Also, what are good HU units for good SQ. I was looking at a Kenwood KDC-HD942U if any knows if that is any good or not. the HU i have now is pitiful. i have to turn the gain all the way up on my amps for it to even go, the preout voltage is really low.
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#1701108 - 09/02/09 02:53 PM
Re: SQ help
[Re: poopyhead]
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Comic Book Guy
Worst. Episode. Ever.
SD First guy voted off Survivor
Registered: 08/11/09
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are you planning on power the new speakers with an external amp or the internal amp on the HU?
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#1701537 - 09/03/09 10:49 AM
Re: SQ help
[Re: Comic Book Guy]
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poopyhead
SD Ralph Wiggum
Registered: 04/12/09
Posts: 32
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external. i have a Hifonics TXi 6408 - 80 rms x4
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#1701675 - 09/03/09 11:54 AM
Re: SQ help
[Re: poopyhead]
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poopyhead
SD Ralph Wiggum
Registered: 04/12/09
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im just wondering how i could get the best possible sq in my car. right now i have 4 pioneer 4way speakers, 2 fi bls in the trunk. anyone have an opinion what i should do about speakers or HU? should i get a dedicated mid/bass driver along with a mid driver and a tweeter, or just a two way component set?
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#1702336 - 09/05/09 01:58 AM
Re: SQ help
[Re: poopyhead]
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sqcomp
SD Roadrunner (Sanus Domanus Ultra-Sonicus Ad Infinitum)
Registered: 07/03/99
Posts: 3585
Loc: VBC Baghdad, Iraq
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The answer to your question is complicated. Not complicated insomuch that it is an advanced answer, but rather it's a multi-step process.
You can make a system sound great with a three way set like you're describing. What you NEED is a very good installation. This is of course the cookie cutter answer...nonetheless it is true.
For me, I'm doing a three way as well. Each pair of my speakers are powered by their own amplifier. I have a total of 8 speakers in the car. This means four amplifiers. None of the speakers are powered by the source unit. The source is there to make signal and put it out to my processor and amplifiers. Nothing else.
This is my start of a good SQ system. Even more than that is what I have supporting the equipment. That's hours and hours of soundeadening time put into the car, the hours of planning and replanning and the hours of layout and setup of said system.
I can say that it isn't complete...simply because I'm in Iraq right now...and the car is just sitting there waiting for me to finish it when I get home.
The other question you had was if you should do a three way set or a two way set. There are VERY successful examples of both layouts in competition. Personally, I'm going with three ways. The less work a pair of speakers has to do is better in my eyes. This is tempered with the amount of time I put into the three way layout. It is more advanced and time consuming versus a two way setup.
I have a tweeter/midrange/mid bass three way setup and then the lowest end is a pair of 15"s taking the bass/sub bass region.
This will take a lot of time to arrainge, tweak, and settle on to be called finished.
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-Be PATIENT!-
This is why the car sounds great!
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#1702360 - 09/05/09 09:46 AM
Re: SQ help
[Re: sqcomp]
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keep_hope_alive
in another life, i'm a serial killer
SD I Power Bombed the Undertaker
Registered: 04/24/07
Posts: 13370
Loc: Quad Cities, IL
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^agreed.
i too am doing my first active 3-way system in years. it's required cutting away metal and will involve a decent amount of custom fabrication.
good "SQ" is a relative term. when i think "SQ" i think about an accurate reproduction of the recording, which includes soundstage, tonality, balance, frequency response, etc. if you want to get an idea what it takes, start reading the MECA, IASCA, USACi rules for SQ judging on install and sound quality. all are free downloads and the links are in the link in my signature.
feel free to click my build log in SoundDomiain Show Off for an idea of what i'm going through for SQ.
4-way speakers are usually awful. you can do much better, but how good you sound is totally dependent on the installation. buying nice speakers is only 20% of getting good sound. you have to spend a good deal of time and effort (and a little bit of money) for a good installation.
you can do it! we can help.
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#1702424 - 09/05/09 06:14 PM
Re: SQ help
[Re: keep_hope_alive]
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poopyhead
SD Ralph Wiggum
Registered: 04/12/09
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thanks. you're project has inspired me man haha. the problem is that I don't really want to put that much money into sound deadening my car since its pretty crappy, but ill do what i can.
i agree with your definition of sq too. that is what i am going for, the most accurate sound.
Right now i'm running four speakers altogether should i not use my rear speakers?
also, im just wondering why you toyed with so many different wire configurations in your set up. what difference did any of them make?
what does your sound processor/brain do? im guessing you use that as active crossovers.
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#1702490 - 09/06/09 08:01 AM
Re: SQ help
[Re: poopyhead]
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keep_hope_alive
in another life, i'm a serial killer
SD I Power Bombed the Undertaker
Registered: 04/24/07
Posts: 13370
Loc: Quad Cities, IL
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the processor is the Alpine PXA-H701 and i have the RUX-C701 controller, check out the manual online for full features. because i cannot create a point source with my three drivers, each one is located a different distance from the listeners. as such, time alignment is provided for each driver. to help with tonality and overall sound tuning, a 1/3rd octave eq is provided for each driver. and to help divide the frequencies, an adjustable crossover (slope and frequency) is provided for each driver. it has eight outputs, i am using six for my front stage 3-way, and the other two will be used for two different sub setups.
there are plenty of other processors out there, several are better than the H701, few are as inexpensive. the three things you want are; 1. time alignment, 2. 1/3rd octave equalizer, 3. crossover (slope and frequency) with selectable HPF, LPF, BPF.
some sound deadening is important. without it any speaker system, regardless of how much it cost, will suffer. you need to deaden the metal around the driver at a minimum. you also need to create an "enclosure". so if you're using the doors for midbass locations, those doors should try to perform like an actual speaker enclosure. one method is to deaden and seal the whole thing. another method is to fabricate an enclosure (sized to the specs of the driver) and locate it on the door. this requires modifications to the interior door panel. but notice how one door is always really close to a listener and one is really far away. time alignment can help with that for a one seat car, but not as much as a two seat car.
some people can make rear speakers work very well. it is a delicate task though and will require experimentation. if your budget is limited, just focus on the front sound stage. you can always run rear speakers off the head unit for some low-level rear "fill".
wiring is necessitated by the system. when you change system components, you change wiring. i prefer speaker wire (speaker and RCA) that are twisted to help reject noise. that is one thing to look for. you can either twist wire yourself (use a drill) or buy wire that is already twisted.
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